October 27, 2022
A group of us (Isaac, Al, Makella, Nicc and George) got together recently to talk about racism and how Co-Production Collective could start to have a conversation about what being an anti-racist community would mean. And following on from that, what being a truly inclusive community for all means.
We have decided to share what we talked about in this conversation and subsequent more in-depth discussions with Isaac and Al with you, as a starting point to exploring what it would take to be an anti-racist community that is inclusive of everyone. This is a conversation that has been on our minds since June 2020 when Nicc and Cristina wrote this blog but we think we need to do more. We would love you to be part of making this happen.
Racism is a lived experience for lots of people including many in our community.
"Co-production has enabled me to have purpose and meaning. However, it is really difficult to find the space in co-production as a brown, disabled, LGBTQI+ person with multiple lived experiences (often called intersectionality), to really express myself and share my lived experiences. I am regularly part of co-production spaces which are predominantly white spaces and the sense of being able to not only feel comfortable but be openly share my experiences is difficult, because as a brown person my experiences are often routed in being othered or people making assumptions or showing racist micro-aggressions. Systemic racism is a problem in society but actually in co-production we mirror that problem, but it’s magnified because it is a smaller group of people in a small community, so it feels much bigger and much more present. We only have to look at the lack of diversity within co-production advisory groups around the country and lack of leadership from black and minoritised communities within co-production. Modelling and seeing people like you in these spaces are really important. When I or anyone else express their concern about systematic racism, institutional racism they are made to feel very uncomfortable. Eyes start rolling, people start to other you. You get the sense that people are very uncomfortable about exploring and understanding how racism plays out in the co-production spaces and we have to actively be anti-racist in practice and look at our own beliefs and behaviours." Isaac
“I will always talk about race because it is such an important factor, and I think that we have a duty to educate the people who attend Co-Production Collective sessions, to understand that their lives may not be rosy, but they don't have the set back of being abused racially on top of any trauma they may or may not have and of not being believed. That's why I always come back to race when I do talk about my experience. When I do there is a lot of “Oh, I’m so sorry” but there is no “Let’s try and explore that a little bit, let’s see. Yes, I totally agree with you Al. Yes, I get it.” Nobody says this, and that scares the hell out of me because it really shows the lack of knowledge around race in the room until I say something. And why should it always be the person of colour that has to say all of this? Why is it always shock, horror when somebody who's white has to listen to it?” Al
Having a diversity and inclusion policy or other anti-racist measures in place isn’t a fix all, they can sometimes often be used as a tick box exercise by organisations that think this means they have sorted out any racism that might have been taking place. Likewise, co-production can be a tick box exercise that results in faux-production as outlined in a recent blog by one of our community.
Work in this area tends to use lots of a catch all terminology like Equality, Diversity and Inclusion (EDI), Black, Asian and Minority Ethnic (BAME) and racially minoritised groups but this kind of catch all terminology is problematic.
“As somebody who is mixed race of dual heritage and a Muslim. What’s the correct wording for all of that? I choose my wording, nobody else does. I define myself.” Al
As Co-Production Collective we bring together people working in a co-produced way and those wanting to learn more on a regular basis. How can we do this in a way that is actively anti-racist? What do we need to change about the way we currently work? And leading on from this, if we don’t want to leave anyone behind and want to create a community that is truly equitable how do we do this in practice? Are we doing enough to ensure that we have created a space that is built on equity?
“I think that we need to have more people of colour. We need to be showing action. We need to be displaying that we are a place of diversity! We are a place that is open to people to come in and talk about their lived experience because that in itself has shaped the Co-Production Collective for years. And all the years I have been involved it has really changed, looking at how people are listening to us and making those changes. But there hasn't really been a thought around the kind of micro-aggressions that people of colour may receive from people within the Collective sessions.” Al
“For me one of the really sad things is we don’t look at where racism stems from, the history of slavery, the history of colonialism and how this has led to the spaces that we can find ourselves in. How do we move our thinking, behaviour and practice if we can’t deal with the history that comes along with this? Co-production is very aligned and rooted in the independent living movement / disability rights movement. However, within these movements the experiences of black and minoritised community members are not ones of being embraced, but othered, excluded. For me we really have to pay attention to the routes of this status quo. Even when they make us feel uncomfortable. These help us be people of inclusion because we look to understand and move past these challenges. This is really painful work and its often people with multiple identities /intersectionality that lead this work. If everyone thinks it’s the right thing to do, why do we not do it? We as a Collective need to be understanding that we don’t all have the same challenge and minimising the barriers does not mean treating everyone the same, it means actively minimising those barriers that people face.” Isaac
“There are many people who have died. There are many people who are disproportionately affected by people in general who have power. I suppose what the Collective could do is really highlight that. Really talk about it, and really ask its members how anti-racist are you? Are you willing to support somebody who has been abused? Are you willing to note when microaggressions take place? Are you willing to defend, to actually be in solidarity, to be an ally to that person because they have given their time, and they are psychologically safe enough in this space to tell you how the world really is versus the rose-tinted glasses that many people wear when walking around, ignoring racial trauma, ignoring people of colour and ignoring our experiences. So, I suppose I just want the Collective as a community to really take a look at itself, and understand that representation is very, very important.” Al
This means we need to agree ways that we can proactively be an anti-racist community and that we need to find agreed ways to deal with situations that arise. That educates people within our community so that we all know how to deal with situations as they arise. So that people feel safe to air how they feel, and they know that the people in the room (physical or virtual) will listen and hear them and see what they can do to actively make sure it doesn’t happen again.
“All too often the victim is the one that has to move away, and the perpetrator is the one who stays wherever it is that they stay. I think the Collective needs to find a way to swap this round and say to the victim ‘Okay, you need to still be with us because we value your input’ and to the person who is expressed those concerns or words, or whatever it is that they've done, they are the ones we need to intensively work with and talk to and say ‘What do you mean? We just need to educate you on this as it is not acceptable for us,’ rather that it being the other way round.” Al
We are aware we need to do more and are committed to doing so. Thoughts so far include:
We would also love to hear from our community about this as we recognise that there is a power in sharing stories in relation to the experience of being othered / not felt welcome – while offering an opportunity to learn and change practice. You can contact us by emailing Nicc on n.pascal@ucl.ac.uk or if you prefer to do so anonymously via this online form.
We came up with some practical ideas as outlined below as a starting point:
Interested in finding out more or exploring how we could work together?
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